Star Lifetyme Dies

[pcmacd]

FOR CLARITY, UPDATE:
I just came across a couple no, several of sets of Star dies.

38 SPL, two sizers, one seater, one standard marked "30 Carbine", and an unmarked "2 STAGE DIE" sizer

Two 38 SPL Lifetyme dies, a standard, and a special die with a note inside showing:

• 0.365" top
• 0.372" bottom

30 Carbine sizer and seater, less seating stem.

Two other Lifetyme dies, one marked "30 Carbine", and the other unmarked.

Plus a couple of other dies that appear to be all steel with no stems or attachments; they are different internally.

Can somebody tell me about these?  Are there adapters available that will allow me to run them in a standard press?

I can supply photos on request.

mac

[rbwillnj]

I have seen some adapters for 11/16-24 to 7/8-14 adapters on eBay from time to time, but they are not common.

If you really need 7/8-14 dies, you would be better off to sell the Star dies and buy a set of 7/8-14 dies.  There are plenty of good ones to choose from.   I might be interested in the 30 Carbine dies that you have, as well as the 38 Special 2S dies.

Bruce

[pcmacd]

I have seen some adapters for 11/16-24 to 7/8-14 adapters on eBay from time to time, but they are not common.

If you really need 7/8-14 dies, you would be better off to sell the Star dies and buy a set of 7/8-14 dies.  There are plenty of good ones to choose from.   I might be interested in the 30 Carbine dies that you have, as well as the 38 Special 2S dies.

Bruce

See attached images.

Image 17 - 30 carbine Lifetyme sizer dies - seater plug missing.

Image 18 - 38 spl Lifetyme dies - one regular, one stepped as previously noted.

The plug between the two unknown dies in image 20 is a seater but is far too large for any of the dies pictured --- it was, however found in the same box.  The dies in image 20 appear to be steel.

(UPDATE:  The plug between the unknown dies (image "star unknown .1.P1010320.jpg") is likely a neck expander of some type and does not fit any of the dies.)

mac

[fc60]

The photos helped a lot.

I can machine replica parts to make the dies complete. Contact me via personal email for price quotes.

Is the 30 Carbine die "Carbide"? If so, it will appear a different color than the die body and may have a witness line of yellow colored Silver Braze retaining it. Star did machine some non-Carbide dies.

Cheers,

Dave Wilson

[pcmacd]

The photos helped a lot.

I can machine replica parts to make the dies complete. Contact me via personal email for price quotes.

Is the 30 Carbine die "Carbide"? If so, it will appear a different color than the die body and may have a witness line of yellow colored Silver Braze retaining it. Star did machine some non-Carbide dies.



Cheers,

Dave Wilson

Pls forgive the stoo-pid question, but are not all of the "LIFETYME" dies carbide?

All four of the sizing dies appear to have carbide inserts.  I'm just a silly, old mechanical engineer, but geezuz, Iben known to make mistakes?

Note that all of the sizing dies are labeled LIFETYME.  I din't realize that the 38s did not reflect this in the photos.

tanks

mac

 

[pcmacd]

The photos helped a lot.

I can machine replica parts to make the dies complete. Contact me via personal email for price quotes.

Is the 30 Carbine die "Carbide"? If so, it will appear a different color than the die body and may have a witness line of yellow colored Silver Braze retaining it. Star did machine some non-Carbide dies.

Cheers,

Dave Wilson

Thanks. I'll likely just end up selling what I have, as soon as I figure out what it all is.

mac

[Rolling Stone]

Could you tell me more about the bullet seater shown between the two dies. I am looking for a seater for round nose bullets and it needs to have a 3/8-24 thread. That is the same as .45 dies for a Star. I would try to buy it if you are going to sell.
Thanks
Rolling Stone

[pcmacd]

Could you tell me more about the bullet seater shown between the two dies. I am looking for a seater for round nose bullets and it needs to have a 3/8-24 thread. That is the same as .45 dies for a Star. I would try to buy it if you are going to sell.
Thanks
Rolling Stone

Thanks for your interest.

The diameter of what appears to be a seater at the thds is 0.498" with a 27 pitch.  

The nose is 0.280" diameter x ~0.300" long, and the whole shebang is 1.445" long.

mac

[pcmacd]

Let me try to sort this out.

I have two dies that are steel and I still have no idea what they are - no markings.

I have two Lifetyme dies - both marked "38 SPL" with one decapping insert w/pin.  One of the dies had a hand written note in it noting the two different diameters that have been previously described.

I have one Lifetyme die clearly marked "30 CARBINE" with one decapping insert w/pin.

I have another unmarked Lifetyme die that had a seating stem in it.  As it looks like a carbide insert, this does not make sense.  Please see image below of measurements.  (Update:  It's a SIZER... see later post.  It had no inserts, just the naked die.)

The measurements with taken with a (-) pin gauge set in thousandths.

The first set of data is for the Lifetyme die marked 30 CARBINE.  The second set of data is for the Lifetyme UNKNOWN die.

MOUTH dimension is the approximate diameter of the die after the mouth relief; a somewhat subjective determination.

TERMINUS dimension is the diameter of the pin that would just fit through the carbide section of the die towards the center.

INTERNAL LENGTH for the MOUTH is the approximate (!) length of the carbide insert.  This was difficult to measure, but I suppose I could have taken the entire die length and subtracted INTERNAL LENGTH.

INTERNAL LENGTH for the TOP is from the top of the die to the beginning of the top of the insert, or whatever is there when the die steps significantly down to the TERMINUS diameter.

Note that both the decapping pin and the seater have a diameter of 0.430 inches (this is the OD of the seater or decap thds) and 27 pitch.

Thanks to all.

mac

(UPDATE:  SEE LATER POST, MARCH 2013 for new table.)

[fc60]

Greetings,

Here goes my guess.

The first die that is marked 30 Carbine is just that.

The second die that is unmarked has dimensions similar to the 30 carbine and may be a "Custom" for thin walled brass. Or, could it be a reject and thus not marked?

The internal thread is 7/16-27, which is common to the 38 Special and, I think, the 32 S&W Long. Lifetyme also used 1/2-27 on the larger caliber sizing dies.

The 30 Carbine being a tapered case like the 9mm will have a hefty chuck of Carbide as compared to the small Carbide rings used on the straightwall pistol cases. Another reason the 30 Carbine and 9mm dies were more expensive.

Cheers,

Dave

[pcmacd]

Greetings,

Here goes my guess.

The first die that is marked 30 Carbine is just that.

The second die that is unmarked has dimensions similar to the 30 carbine and may be a "Custom" for thin walled brass. Or, could it be a reject and thus not marked?

The internal thread is 7/16-27, which is common to the 38 Special and, I think, the 32 S&W Long. Lifetyme also used 1/2-27 on the larger caliber sizing dies.

The 30 Carbine being a tapered case like the 9mm will have a hefty chuck of Carbide as compared to the small Carbide rings used on the straightwall pistol cases. Another reason the 30 Carbine and 9mm dies were more expensive.

Cheers,

Dave

Thanks, Dave.

I have not had time to consider the details.

However, Dave, that would make the brass about 0.001" thick at the mouth if you do the math.

• 0.310" - 0.308" = 0.002

So, I have to wonder....?  WTW?

Probably not for 30 CARBINE, but, hey, who knows?

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

The 38 SPL regular, 30 CARBINE, and UNKNOWN dies have a continuum of carbide from the mouth to the end of the TERMINUS as previously described by me.

The 38 SPL "2 STAGE DIE" as previously described has TWO discreet rings.  One at the mouth [CARBIDE fer sure], and one ~0.520" from the mouth [the second step or ring could be / is likely STEEL.  Canno tell fer sure.]

Weird.  Iben reloading for a long time and have never seen anything like that!

mac

[rbwillnj]

I have Lifetyme two stage dies for both 45 ACP and 38 Special.  Both sizing rings are carbide.

I have never been clear about the purpose of two stage sizing dies.  One member suggested they were for sizing Remington brass which he suggested was thinner.

Bruce

[fc60]

Greetings Bruce,

Yes, sizing R-P brass and older Western brass. At least, that is what Star told me when I purchased the ones I have in the late 1980's.

R-P 45 brass from the 1960's had a wall thickness of 0.008"-0.009" as compared with 0.010" currently produced.

Cheers,

Dave

[pcmacd]

Could you tell me more about the bullet seater shown between the two dies. I am looking for a seater for round nose bullets and it needs to have a 3/8-24 thread. That is the same as .45 dies for a Star. I would try to buy it if you are going to sell.
Thanks
Rolling Stone

It is likely an expander die as noted elsewhere here by me (search for UPDATE:), and methinks another.

[pcmacd]

I just bought the Clark 38 SPL wadcutter gun that my Bullseye shooting mentor owned.  This renewed my interest in the Star dies I have from a different estate sale purchase.  Read on, dear shooters...

As was discussed in a previous post in this thread, we thought the unknown die noted in image "star 20 carbide lifetyme .1.P1010317.jpg" dated May 24, 2011, 10:46:42 AM, might be a 30 carbine, but with a ~0.310 diameter of the second sizing stage, this is not likely.

So, I made some more careful measurements on this mystery die.  See attachment "mystery die and carbine liftyme carbide insert measurements. 2 .jpg".  

Please also see attachment "30 carbine in both .smaller. IMAG0722.jpg", with a 0.30 an unsized carbine shoved in by hand as far as I dare...

• I have neither a Star machine nor adapters for a Dillon 550 or Forester Co-Ax that will permit me to do a full length size to compare the outcomes.
  

..

At any rate, what can this mystery die be?  Even in the sixties, I cannot imagine, even a company as loosely organized as Star Machine Works, could let a product out the door w/o a clear designation of its pedigree???

Your thoughts?

mac