Phelps VS Star Lubrisizer!

[seagiant]

Hi,
     I was sold a used lubrisizer as an old Star but after looking at the pictures here on the site I believe it is a Phelps instead? The machine looks well built and it takes the Star sizers that I have > Is there any reason I should take it back or is it pretty much as good as a Star??? By the way I paid $100 for it and was told it was a Star! The thing is that the new Star lubrisizers from Magma Engineering is close to $200 dollars now and I don't see one of these sizers used hardly any more so I'm thinking of just keeping it and using it if I wasn't blatantly ripped off! Just wondering what the membership thought of this? Thanks for any ideas or opinions!

[Ross Chesley]

Hi Seagiant,

I do believe that in order to verify whether yours is a Star or Phelps, you have only to examine the aluminum base to see if it is stamped Star Machine Works or if it is not.

If the seller represented it as a Star, then you surely have a claim against them, and should at the least ask them to demonstrate how they came to the representation... I would approach it as if it was a possible mistake and you can work with them if you feel there are some adjustements needed to price, or just to satisfy that you were not intentionally mislead. A good seller will take interest after the sale.

To the matter of whether Phelps or Star is better, you can certainly find many sides here. We do have some informational brochures, and the Phelps was a copy of the Star, so operation should not be different in any way.

I once paid a good sum for a Star Lube-Sizer that appeared to be in fair condition. Once it was cleaned up and inspected, it was nearly a basket case from misuse and neglect. It will take hundreds of dollars to put it back to operational condition, or many hours with a welder, grinder, and machine tools. I'd consider a Phelps in good condition as much preferred, $100 is not a bad price.

Verifying your Star dies fit and work means the most important part -- the quality of the dies that do the resizing -- is perfectly fine. Magma Engineering is always most interested in selling you a new product, but they also carry parts you can purchase to keep your Star or Phelps running just fine. Just do not expect to rebuild it for less than a new Magma Star, but Hycar washers, springs, and other incidental parts that may need to be replaced are reasonable and will keep yours running for years if you care for it properly.

I also recommend Stillwell Tool and Die at www.sizingdie.com if you need any dies. I found them to be wonderful to work with and they make great dies that work with Star, Phelps and other lube-sizer tools. They can also rework dies so it would be a great site to check out if you are not happy with a die, need one specially made, etc.

If you have means to take some pictures of your lube-sizer, post them or send to the admin and get them posted so we can see condition and perhaps lend more support to your idea it is a Phelps.

[seagiant]

Hi Ross,
            Thank you very much for you're comments. I feel a little better about the machine anyway if not the misrepensation of the seller! I guess the bottom line is that if it works ok then it's worth the money and I didn't get hurt or ripped off money wise. I have a real Magma star but have not seen an old original San Diego Star and thought that might have accounted for the slight differences when I saw this lubsizer! Thinking that it was an old Star when I bought it. It does not have the name Star any where on it and I can even see where someone wire wheeled the decal where they are on the Phelps! All of this insight after seeing the Phelps machine here!

         You mention some items that appear available locally one is a certain gasket. Could you explain some more on these materials and techniques on rebuilding a Star???
                                                    Thanks again!

[seagiant]

Hi,
    Well I thought I would give my observations on my Phelps lubrisizer after finally using it. First off the punch that came on the sizer is not a bullet base punch like a Star but a nose punch where you wuold put the base in the die first and push it through with the ram. I don't really care for this being used to a Star so changed this out with my Star punch which fit perfectly and sized everything nose first as I'm used to. Having a lathe I think I can fix the nose punch into a base punch so there's nothing lost there!

     I'm going to have to admit that once I started using this machine that I really enjoyed it! I was lubing some RCBS 150 gr. "Kieth Style" SWC bullets with some homemade beeswax mix. The pump on the machine worked fine no leaks what so ever and when a bullet grease band showed a glitch one turn on the resevior handle and you were back in business! And actually that is how it is suppose to work and also had no trouble with excess lube on the nose of the bullets which the nice people at Magma told me was because of excess pressure in the resevior. I had had this trouble with my Star and had called for help.

    So to sum this up when I first realized that this was a Phelps machine instead of a Star I was a little dissapointed but after using it now I think I would buy another if given the chance! Also I forgot to mention that I also got a .45 cal Star sizing die with this machine so I feel pretty good now. Hope this wasn't to long but thought some one sitting on the fence looking at a Phelps might be interested! If anyone has one of these and you're using it I would really like to hear about your opinions on it!
                                                              Thanks!

[Kenneth L. Walters]

Star L/S were always very well made, as are the current Magma's.  The corresponding Phelps, however, varied depending on who owned the company at the time and whether or not they cared.

That said, from a purely collector's point of view I would think that the Phelps is the rarer machine.  Don't think that they made all that many.  Certainly I don't remember seeing one.

[eaglemike]

The Star standard punch was to size the bullet base first. The base comes out more uniform this way, and accuracy is better - the alignment of the bullet through the sizing die is also more nearly perfect this way. The nose first punch will work with more bullet shapes, and is easier to make. Each punch was individually turned on a small South Bend belt driven lathe.

Phelps quality varied quite a bit, reloaders and lubri-sizers. I saw a lot of correspondence at Star, regarding the repair and set-up of Phelps tools. Star would not guarantee that they could get it working correctly, or that parts would fit.

[jasta]

whats to wear? pivot pins and holes ok so ream and fit over size pins! pump  piston and sleve ok so ream tell it cleans up and make a new over size piston or resleve with a brozne valve giuld and new piston and about the[ punch was individually turned on a small South Bend belt driven lathe] the final fit of the punch to die was done on a small bench top monarch that that shister that owned panican coffee ended up with.....................

[tazmandm]

I've had a star since 1968 and have ran many thousand of lead bullet threw it. I use lyman grease and have never had a problem.
My reloader is as good today as it was in 1968. a little oil here and there keeps it going good. I need some new casing tubes